Saddleback Forum

[scooterbug44]

I shudder to think what would happen in Washington if our leaders there weren't being guided by a high moral standard.

Are you serious? Is there another Washington somewhere where they are faithful to their spouses, aren't propositioning their staff, and don't take bribes?

 

[30ashopper]

Are you serious? Is there another Washington somewhere where they are faithful to their spouses, aren't propositioning their staff, and don't take bribes?

I wasn't talking about the Democrats.

 

[scooterbug44]

Neither was I!

 

[LuciferSam]

. I hate to think what would happen to this country if we completely removed some of our most cherished principals.

Belief in a higher power isn't necessary to retain those principles. Many theists scoff at this assertion because they try to apply their mindset and worldview, which is based on belief, to the nontheist.

 

[Geo]

I shudder to think what would happen in Washington if our leaders there weren't being guided by a high moral standard.

Also, note that 85% of the country is religious, 80% of that Christian. Politicians involve themselves in forums like this precisely because so many of their constituents believe in God and Christ. To ignore faith in this country would pretty much guarantee they'd never get elected. It's important to a majority of Americans.

I'd also like to add - having been raised Catholic and having a love and respect for that church and it's doctrine, I'm a little insulted by some here implying my church has any similarity to Bin Laden's. You can apply religion in right ways and in wrong ways. Religion is not the enemy here. This country has been guided by religion since its founding. That guidance helped build the richest, most charitable, most prosperous nation in the world. I hate to think what would happen to this country if we completely removed some of our most cherished principals.

Of course you are. And he is insulted too...
This is a classic example of why it scares me that religion is so pervasive. Because the religious feel only their religion is right.

EDIT: Forgot to add- I really enjoyed the part where you gave credit to the guidance of religion for helping us to become so rich, charitable and prosperous. Good stuff...

 

[Bob]

I shudder to think what would happen in Washington if our leaders there weren't being guided by a high moral standard.

Also, note that 85% of the country is religious, 80% of that Christian. Politicians involve themselves in forums like this precisely because so many of their constituents believe in God and Christ. To ignore faith in this country would pretty much guarantee they'd never get elected. It's important to a majority of Americans.

I'd also like to add - having been raised Catholic and having a love and respect for that church and it's doctrine, I'm a little insulted by some here implying my church has any similarity to Bin Laden's. You can apply religion in right ways and in wrong ways. Religion is not the enemy here. This country has been guided by religion since its founding. That guidance helped build the richest, most charitable, most prosperous nation in the world. I hate to think what would happen to this country if we completely removed some of our most cherished principals.

If you can love the Catholic church, well, you must be a Very loving person. Your church has much more power and money than Bin Laden. They can stroke buggery checks from here to eternity.

 

[GoodWitch58]

I shudder to think what would happen in Washington if our leaders there weren't being guided by a high moral standard.

Moral: of, pertaining to, or concerned with the principles or rules of right conduct or the distinction between right and wrong; ethical: moral attitudes.

You mean the high moral standard of only fighting just wars in defence of our country; of integrity and honesty and justice toward all our citizens; and human rights towards all people of the world; of abiding by the treaties and agreements we sign on to; and the Constitution many of us swore to uphold and protect?

You mean that kind of moral standard?

 

[Andy A]

It has become obvious to me that not only are there many far left zealots on this site but there are many with atheistic leanings as well. That is fine. It is what I and many others put ourselves in harm's way many times for and I am glad you are able to put forth your opinions and thoughts as is, of course, your right as American citizens. Your opinions and thoughts do not agree with mine and, once again that is fine. But bear this in mind. If you should be wrong about many of your ideas, it not only could come back to take away all so many have fought valiantly to protect, it could also really take away all those rights, liberties and freedoms you already "perceive" you have lost and in reality have not. Am I trying to scare you with patriotic rhetoric? No, certainly not. It is impossible to scare or get anyone to accept ideals they do not believe in, in the first place. There is a wide, wide breach in this country between how people see our past, present and future. I just wish it wasn't so, and I am afraid. Afraid these differences will destroy the country I grew up in, fought for and love.

 

[Linda]

It has become obvious to me that not only are there many far left zealots on this site but there are many with atheistic leanings as well. That is fine. It is what I and many others put ourselves in harm's way many times for and I am glad you are able to put forth your opinions and thoughts as is, of course, your right as American citizens. Your opinions and thoughts do not agree with mine and, once again that is fine. But bear this in mind. If you should be wrong about many of your ideas, it not only could come back to take away all so many have fought valiantly to protect, it could also really take away all those rights, liberties and freedoms you already "perceive" you have lost and in reality have not. Am I trying to scare you with patriotic rhetoric? No, certainly not. It is impossible to scare or get anyone to accept ideals they do not believe in, in the first place. There is a wide, wide breach in this country between how people see our past, present and future. I just wish it wasn't so, and I am afraid. Afraid these differences will destroy the country I grew up in, fought for and love.

Hi Andy - "You're a great American"!!!!!

 

[idlewind]

It just never ceases to amaze me how left-wing zealots can rail about the "power" of right wing churches but not find fault when their candidate does much worse in left leaning churches. I guarentee that if McCain spoke in Hagee's church, the plate was passed for him and Hagee told his people from the pulpit to vote for him the roar from the left would be deafening. But when Obama does the same thing, that is OK. If a book was pulled that mocked Jesus Christ, the left would be indignant, but a book about Mohammed in love is pulled for fear of offending Muslims and not one peep is heard about censorship. There is a clear double standard.

It also kills me that left wingers can complain about negative campaigning when their darling is compared to Paris Hilton but see nothing wrong in repeatedly questioning Bush's integrity. Like I said, there is a clear double standard and it does not come from the right.

As for me, I do not believe in any church endorsing candidates or any faith being favored over another. I only think we should be fair to everyone. I did not have a problem with the saddleback forum because no candidate was endorsed and the format was fair. And I agree with Rick Warren, separation of church and state does not mean the separation of faith and politics. Faith of whatever stripe is a worldview and voters have a need to know the worldview of all candidates.