A return to civility

[scooterbug44]

No, I said that upbringing is more responsible than IQ. Bob said it was IQ. I was refuting this statement by scooterbug "Yes, I do! There are scientifically quantifiable differences between the sexes and different races. These do not however, effect one's overall intelligence or ability." And it wasn't a hypothesis, it was a fact. Until someone comes up with a better way to measure IQ, all we have is what is the established and accepted tool.

I agree that how one is raised is more important then your intelligence level in determining whether you will be polite or well mannered.

A high IQ doesn't mean you are smart, it means you scored well on a flawed test.

My beef is with you always thinking that it depends on your race, gender, or income level. I don't have my manners because I'm a female, or of european descent, or make X amount of money. I have them because that is how I was raised.

Part of my original post was that you need to see people as individuals and by doing so break down barriers - not further categorize and stereotype them.

 

[6thGen]

I agree that how one is raised is more important then your intelligence level in determining whether you will be polite or well mannered.

A high IQ doesn't mean you are smart, it means you scored well on a flawed test.

My beef is with you always thinking that it depends on your race, gender, or income level. I don't have my manners because I'm a female, or of european descent, or make X amount of money. I have them because that is how I was raised.

Part of my original post was that you need to see people as individuals and by doing so break down barriers - not further categorize and stereotype them.

Again, I never said civility depends on race or income level, I said that it was a factor in upbringing, which was a factor of civility. My beef with most of this board is despite the rhetoric on getting to the roots of problems and understanding them, most of you put your head in the sand when it comes to politically incorrect factors such as race, religion or class. I am all for seeing people as individuals, but handicapping IQ tests because they are unfair to blacks is not only patronizing, it is racist to expect less. Also, do you deny that scores on IQ tests correlate with a person?s intelligence?

 

[scooterbug44]

I agree that IQ scores roughly correlate with your potential for intelligence.

I've seen a lot of "book smart & life dumb" in my day!

IQ tests are flawed for a variety of reasons, not just because of a potential racial bias. Depends on who gives the test, who scores the test, whether the person takes tests well, how many times they have taken it, whether they studied/were prepped for it etc.

 

[6thGen]

I agree that IQ scores roughly correlate with your potential for intelligence.

I've seen a lot of "book smart & life dumb" in my day!

IQ tests are flawed for a variety of reasons, not just because of a potential racial bias. Depends on who gives the test, who scores the test, whether the person takes tests well, how many times they have taken it, whether they studied/were prepped for it etc.

You have intelligence and knowledge mixed up. In short, intelligence represents the ability to reason or learn. Knowledge is the learned information. IQ tests don?t ask who the 23rd President of the US was, they gauge an individual?s ability to read and retain the fact that Benjamin Harrison was this republic?s 23rd President. That is one reason it is difficult to study or prepare for one. It would be like studying for a foot race.

 

[scooterbug44]

You have intelligence and knowledge mixed up. In short, intelligence represents the ability to reason or learn. Knowledge is the learned information. IQ tests don?t ask who the 23rd President of the US was, they gauge an individual?s ability to read and retain the fact that Benjamin Harrison was this republic?s 23rd President. That is one reason it is difficult to study or prepare for one. It would be like studying for a foot race.

Knowledge is retention of facts or techniques. Intelligence is how you function, reason, acquire and use knowledge.

A dyslexic person would score poorly in your example of reading comprehension and retention, so it would not be a good measure of their ability to learn the information.

People "study" for foot races all the time. It's called training!

 

[Mango]

Again, I never said civility depends on race or income level, I said that it was a factor in upbringing, which was a factor of civility.

Well then, I am curious on your take with how religion equates in this theory, because it's my opinion that most religions preach something akin to "love thy Neighbor" and "Peace be with you", which is a practice in civility and has nothing to do with race or income level. ????

IMO, this whole debate is really an exercise in futility. It's like trying to figure out if conservatives are more civil than liberals.

 

[6thGen]

People "study" for foot races all the time. It's called training!

And people can study for IQ tests through reading and problem or puzzle solving. Regardless, no matter how much I trained, I would not be able to beat Deion Sanders in a foot race (IQ test is another matter). It would be silly to note that my shorter stride and less impressive physique made the foot race biased.

 

[6thGen]

Well then, I am curious on your take with how religion equates in this theory, because it's my opinion that most religions preach something akin to "love thy Neighbor" and "Peace be with you", which is a practice in civility and has nothing to do with race or income level. ????

IMO, this whole debate is really an exercise in futility. It's like trying to figure out if conservatives are more civil than liberals.

It depends on the tenets on the religion, thus the religion itself. Again, religion factors into upbringing, basic beliefs and culture. For that matter you could compare people from Charleston to people from Manhattan. I agree that this is an exercise in futility, but if you want to argue on if conservatives or liberals are more civil, it has far more to do with who is in power, rather than the philosophy itself.

 

[Miss Kitty]

Well then, I am curious on your take with how religion equates in this theory, because it's my opinion that most religions preach something akin to "love thy Neighbor" and "Peace be with you", which is a practice in civility and has nothing to do with race or income level. ????

IMO, this whole debate is really an exercise in futility. It's like trying to figure out if conservatives are more civil than liberals.

Hey Mango...is now the time to say...please STFU?

 

[Mango]

Hey Mango...is now the time to say...please STFU?

Yes, we changed it to PSTFU. Thank you.
Think we should make it, PSTFUTU?