Gender in the workplace/world

[scooterbug44]

I was absolutely floored by the statement in the "Hilary on Dave last night" thread that woman are anti-Hilary because they feel "a woman's place is in the home, not running the country".

Do people seriously believe that women can't do any job they want to?

I am NOT saying that every woman is qualified or suited for every single job, (just as every man isn't qualified or suited for every single job) but that there isn't a good reason why a woman can't do any job she wants.

I've had a variety of jobs - retail and white collar - where people assumed I didn't know something because I was a female or was just there because I was the daughter, spouse, etc. of the business owner. It is rather humorous because it is ALWAYS to their disadvantage (as most "isms" eventually are).

Thoughts?

 

[seacrestkristi]

Did you see the story on the nat'l news where when trying to figure out why women in the workplace make like 77c to every $1.00 a man makes they figured it was because women don't negotiate like men do? Over and over, we just say okay, according to this study anyhow. Not only do we need to demand more pay but also more respect for one another as women and we could get so much further. So many women play all these weird workplace power games. Sorry that has been my personal experience only.

 

[NoHall]

I was absolutely floored by the statement in the "Hilary on Dave last night" thread that woman are anti-Hilary because they feel "a woman's place is in the home, not running the country".

Do people seriously believe that women can't do any job they want to?

I am NOT saying that every woman is qualified or suited for every single job, (just as every man isn't qualified or suited for every single job) but that there isn't a good reason why a woman can't do any job she wants.

I've had a variety of jobs - retail and white collar - where people assumed I didn't know something because I was a female or was just there because I was the daughter, spouse, etc. of the business owner. It is rather humorous because it is ALWAYS to their disadvantage (as most "isms" eventually are).

Thoughts?

I would take more time to discuss this, but I have to get back to running my landscape company. I did write a blog that addresses a specific area of this, if you're interested...

 

[30A Skunkape]

I have heard the 77 cent on the dollar figure disputed before since it came from the census bureau and simply considered what a group of women earned versus a group of men with no consideration of occupation. Homework for somebody-what is the trend, and is there a big difference when comparing apples to apples?

 

[scooterbug44]

I would take more time to discuss this, but I have to get back to running my landscape company. I did write a blog that addresses a specific area of this, if you're interested...

Post or PM the blog link - always interested in hearing more!

 

[NoHall]

Post or PM the blog link - always interested in hearing more!

The blog link is right under my 'tar, but I originally posted it as a [ame="http://www.sowal.com/bb/showthread.php?t=16694"]thread[/ame].

As for the 77 cents on the dollar, I was actually thinking about that this morning. I make the same amount as men in my field(s), but they're highly specialized. I also wonder how it is in the rest of the world, if that's still accurate.

 

[scooterbug44]

I agree w/ your post/blog statement that "my experience is NOT that there is gender bias in the field, just a gap."

My feeling is that the respective professions/academia are just slowly catching up with the new demographics, not that one gender is more suited to a profession than the other.

I think variations in personality and learning styles will always push certain people towards certain professions, but that the determining traits are not gender based.

 

[seacrestkristi]

The blog link is right under my 'tar, but I originally posted it as a thread.

As for the 77 cents on the dollar, I was actually thinking about that this morning. I make the same amount as men in my field(s), but they're highly specialized. I also wonder how it is in the rest of the world, if that's still accurate.

It was just reported on the national news about a week ago. Think it was NBC. They actually showed the double blind study that offered both men and women the same amt for some simple test. They were told they would be paid between $4 - $11 per test. Then when they came in with the test they were told they would actually be paid $4 per test. The men were like, "Where's the $10. I want $10." They were told okay. The women invariably when told they would actually be paid $4 per test just smiled or looked a little surprised and said okay. It was like they didn't want to make waves or 'say anything'.

 

[NoHall]

I agree w/ your post/blog statement that "my experience is NOT that there is gender bias in the field, just a gap."

My feeling is that the respective professions/academia are just slowly catching up with the new demographics, not that one gender is more suited to a profession than the other.

I think variations in personality and learning styles will always push certain people towards certain professions, but that the determining traits are not gender based.

I was talking about it with two of my professors (the male head of the department and a female with a doctorate.) I asked the male professor what he thought about the disproportion in the field of conducting. He said, "I don't think it's disproportionate."

I looked at him and said, "The world is 51% percent female and 49% male. You're saying that 51% of the conductors are female?"

He said no, he wasn't saying that. (Later he even admitted that conducting was a closed boys' club.) But he and the female professor dove into a discussion about how there are certain professions that require a lot of flexibility; you have to be able to commit to long hours and running off on a moment's notice. A lot of women can't commit to that because of family or won't commit to it because they want to plan for families.

I thought it was a valid point. Several of the females I've asked have answered along the lines of, "I don't want all the headache/responsibility/demands that go with those upper echelon jobs." A lot of the females who have the intelligence, talent and training for the jobs are not as ambitious as their male counterparts; they don't require or desire recognition. I know that's the case with me a lot of times; I don't really care about being famous (I'm already a big deal!) I just want to do what I enjoy and pay the bills.

It was just reported on the national news about a week ago. Think it was NBC. They actually showed the double blind study that offered both men and women the same amt for some simple test. They were told they would be paid between $4 - $11 per test. Then when they came in with the test they were told they would actually be paid $4 per test. The men were like, "Where's the $10. I want $10." They were told okay. The women invariably when told they would actually be paid $4 per test just smiled or looked a little surprised and said okay. It was like they didn't want to make waves or 'say anything'.

Maybe I'm just not girly enough. I want my $10 so that I can get a pedicure.

 

[scooterbug44]

It was just reported on the national news about a week ago. Think it was NBC. They actually showed the double blind study that offered both men and women the same amt for some simple test. They were told they would be paid between $4 - $11 per test. Then when they came in with the test they were told they would actually be paid $4 per test. The men were like, "Where's the $10. I want $10." They were told okay. The women invariably when told they would actually be paid $4 per test just smiled or looked a little surprised and said okay. It was like they didn't want to make waves or 'say anything'.

Interesting study - did they just divide it between men & women or did they also study age, ethnicity, and region as factors? I have an aunt in Chicago who would have biatched until they gave her $15 just for telling her she'd get $11 then giving her $4! :funn: